Pontiac People, how many do we have here?

[Hammer]

Mike, it's a '72 Grand Ville. It's been my daily ride for the last 9 years.
It served a faithfull 235,350 miles.

You got that many miles out of an engine that was Engineered in the 70's to only last less than 100,000 miles.  You must have taken excellent care of that motor!

Sorry, about mistaking your Grand Ville from a regular Bonneville.  There is a significant difference as the Grand Ville's were much more luxurious than the straight end Bonnevilles in the B-body GM series.  The wheel base alone made them ride like you were running on a cloud all the time....so smooth.  My best friend in high school owned a 72 Catalina and it rode like a dream.  Much like your ride there.  

The pictures you have for your car must have been taken at 20 feet my friend as that car of yours looks spectacular.  And the color is stunning.  I would never go back to the original color mate.  She is a beauty.  

   

[us2oz]

Hi Mike,
 Welcome to the AMCCA forum & its nice to have some input from a fellow Musclecar enthusiast based in the homeland of our hobby!!
 I have just returned from a one month stay in Georgia & man it was cold there!!Also went to Az & purchased a couple of cars for my business here which is Micks USMusclecars & Classics.One of those cars is a 81 TransAm Pacecar that I think Joe may of mentioned to you.The odd thing is it has the 80 pace car graphics?so I am keen to authenticate this car & establish its pedigreee as  genuine pace car,Joe tells me"Your The Man"when it comes to the Firebirds.Any help would be appreciated.

Cheers Mick

[BRD O PREY]

Hi Mick,

I was reading your post about your 81 pace car. The best and only way to establish it pedigree is to contact Pontiac Historical Society. For around $100.00 U.S., you can get a window sticker, the shipping info, date ordered, and from dealership. I have used them many times. I have owned transams since 1978, it was my first new car, black ttops and WS6 option. It now lives in Newcastle. Back in the day the transam was the only car a that any red blooded American boy would even think about buying. I hope this helps, the pace car was the last really great option that they put on the Transam before the end of '81. Good choice.

Regards
Seppo

[us2oz]

Hey Seppo thanks for that, yes I will definatley do that in the near future, the tag all reads good has the Y85 option and all the necessary numbers for the recaro interior etc. would just be nice to have the docs to go with it.

Cheers Mick


[Edited on 9-2-11 by us2oz]

[Hammer]

Mick, thank you for the warm welcome here and the tip of the hat from my good friend Joe74ta.  (Joe I will not let you down mate).

There are a few ways to verify your car is actual 1981 Pace car.  Seppo is absolutely correct that one way is obtaining the PHS (aka Pontiac Historical Services) Documents from my good friend Jim Mattison the owner of PHS.  Here is a recent picture of Jim and I together.  

Oh, and here is one of me and John Schinella who was the Chief Design Engineer at General motors and was the only one responsible for the invention of the hood bird in 1973 that went into production as an option.


But enough about who I know.........and back to your question.

The PHS documents are one way of Proof you have a 1981 Pace car.  There is a second but it requires removing the back seat of the car and searching for an 22cm by 28cm Sheet of paper.  That is called a build sheet and is like gold for these cars.  It indicates EVERYTHING that was put on the car from the factory.  Make a copy of it if you find it and put it away for safe keeping mate.  You do not want to lose the original.  If the build sheet is not behind the rear seat it has been found under the front seat in the mesh lining and the last place they always left a build sheet was above the gas tank.  The build sheet is even more important than the PHS if you can find it.  

Here is what a Build Sheet looks like- This one is pink because this build sheet for this car was the first Y84 which GM specially made for Burt Reynolds.  Eventually over the years this car was sold too the owner of National Parts Depot and is proudly on Display at National Parts Depot's home office in Florida.  
 

GM used a pink build sheet to indicate to the production line a new change but most build sheets were white.  

We all know mate that a lot can happen over 30 some years and interior changes as well as exterior paint alterations were common.  Therefore, although your car may seem to have all the aspects of an 80 Pace car it was obvious the previous owner along the lines wanted the car to look like that as it DID NOT come that way from a perfectly good GM factory.  

I hope this helps.  

P.S. It should have Recaro seats too.   Please keep in mind my expertise as a judge, as I worked for Trans Am Specialties at one point in my career, was for the Firebirds from 1969 to 1981. I can decode your cowl tag data information for you if you post it.  

[us2oz]

Thanks for the info,
 Yeah,I doubt that the build sheet would still be in place as the car has undergone a rotissorie resto. incl. new trim quite recently so its a good bet thats already gone(Cant really check as the car is still in AZ at friends house) & there was no original docs with the car when I purchased it a couple of weeks ago at the classic car auctions in AZ.
 The Cowl tag does have the Y85 code & the correct AR9 code for Recaro Trim & the CC1 code for fisher body T Tops but cant see a code for upper & lower paint?I will send you a pic of the Cowl tag if you like.I will get your email address off Joe & send it direct.
 It definately did not leave the factory with the wrong decals & the mistake was obviously made when it was restored recently but it is confusing as to why someone would go to so much trouble to restore a rare factory original & make such a huge mistake by fitting the wrong Graphics as it is(according to the VIN)definately an 81 model but has 80 Indy Pace car Decals & Bird?But has the correct 81 trim with the red & black combo.(It is unfortunately missing the Recaro's).
 The car has had a lot of time & money spent & will make a nice new addition to the list of original left hand drive cars now able to cruise the streets of Aus. as 81 is now 30 yrs ago(wow where did the time go!!)so cars of this age can now be rego'ed LHD under our historic rules.
 But before I find the correct front seats & start spending money on it I just want to be sure it is what it is supposed to be.
 There are a few pics of the car on my website http://usmusclecars.com.au/ click on the Yellow Yenko Camaro as they are in the coming soon ad with that.
 Thanks Again        Mick......
 

[Hammer]

http://www.phs-online.com/

There you go Mick.  PHS direct here on line above.  It seems you have a great sense for cowl tag data deciphering as well as Vin number decoding.  It sounds like you know your business well.  I will not waste your time with the cowl tag.  The reason the Y85 doesn't have upper or lower exterior paint codes is because GM knew the Y85 only had one color for that package.  I am certain if you have an X in your VIN and the cowl tag states Y85 then you have the real thing and it is a Pace Car.

You can check out the difference here between 1980 and 1981.  
http://www.78ta.com/pacecar.php

And since this was a rotisserie restoration I have no idea why they wouldn't have painted the car the scheme of 1980.

The 1981 is rarer than the 1980's.  I'd question the integrity of the car and weather all the numbers match on the car or the reason behind the change to the 1980 decals.  Something just isn't adding up for me on this one.  

[us2oz]

Mike, Blow and behold I get to work today and in my fax machine is the PHS document, my wife ordered it yesterday afternoon and paid the extra for the fax service, what a top service that is! and I mean my wife too.
The document confirms definatley 81 Pace Car with all the correct options, so I guess the person who carried out the resto for some reason placed the incorrect decals on the car! Oh well thats an easy fix if need be.
Once again thanks for your input.

Mick:hangloose:

[Hammer]

and I mean my wife too.

LOL

Yer, Jim Mattison at PHS is good people.  I promise I will let him know personally you appreciate his services.  Jim is also the owner of the only Kammback Trans Am from 1978 in existence (the silver one).  http://allgentransams.com/seta/kammback/kammback1.html

Good luck with your Trans Am and congratulations on such a rare model (as only 2000 were made).  I'd put on the other decals to bring it back to original condition but the recaro seats will be a tough find, sorry to say.  

Mike  

[68 GTO]

Pontiacs rule

Owned far too many now, just got the 68 GTO and a project 69 GP left now.......for now anyway :-)